[2025-11-27T01:19:08Z] <kris_> so far i think vis is pretty good
[2025-11-27T01:19:14Z] <kris_> its kind of the epitome of >hey this just works
[2025-11-27T01:19:27Z] <kris_> im probably going to have to write a plugin to get autopairs though because i don't see one to do that
[2025-11-27T01:19:44Z] <kris_> nvm found one i'm just stupy
[2025-11-27T06:07:58Z] <sad_plan> kris_: vis is pretty comfy
[2025-11-27T06:52:14Z] <sewn> I don't know how its comfy when it has no proper user manuals, no helpful community, barely any quality changes, and is lacking features expected in a modern text editor
[2025-11-27T06:52:48Z] <sewn> helix is comfier by definition because all you need is the editor; it has a tutorial built in, and each key sequence has a popup so you can see which one does what
[2025-11-27T07:39:19Z] <sad_plan> you even used to like vis, so I dont get where youre comming from here. an editor dont need a bajillion features. it needs to be able to edit text, effectivly so
[2025-11-27T07:39:41Z] <sad_plan> usermanual is sufficient. it shows what you need, no more, no less
[2025-11-27T07:44:09Z] <midfavila> kris_: how is vis any more 'just werks' than ed
[2025-11-27T07:44:16Z] <midfavila> i will fight you on this
[2025-11-27T07:48:24Z] <sad_plan> atleast vis provides you with something more visual if anything. ive been wanting to give ed a proper go, and I even have a cheatsheet for it, but I never get around to it
[2025-11-27T08:01:41Z] <sewn> sad_plan: "you even used to like vis" therefore im the best person to talk about it lmfao
[2025-11-27T08:01:51Z] <sewn> "you used to be such a big supporter of trump"
[2025-11-27T08:02:02Z] * sewn pats midfavila
[2025-11-27T08:05:41Z] <sewntheGOAT> goodmorning i know a girl who only use acme to code so i rly dont think u can go wrong
[2025-11-27T08:05:47Z] <sewntheGOAT> no other thoughts
[2025-11-27T08:07:16Z] <Ozymandias42> wasn't acme the editor from Plan9 ?
[2025-11-27T08:07:24Z] <Ozymandias42> morning btw., Eva
[2025-11-27T08:07:57Z] <sewntheGOAT> GOOD MORNING OZY
[2025-11-27T08:08:06Z] <sewntheGOAT> i like u more than i like dancing in the kitchen in my underwear
[2025-11-27T08:08:14Z] <Ozymandias42> now that's an achievement :D
[2025-11-27T08:08:21Z] <Ozymandias42> I like you too. You're fun
[2025-11-27T08:08:53Z] <Ozymandias42> I'm already in quasi-weekend mode. Two days of homeoffice left before real weekend
[2025-11-27T08:17:06Z] <sewntheGOAT> oooh i see
[2025-11-27T08:17:12Z] <sewntheGOAT> i didnt wna spend all day with u anyway
[2025-11-27T08:17:13Z] <sewntheGOAT> its whatevs
[2025-11-27T08:17:41Z] <Ozymandias42> right you are, absence make the heart grow fonder and all that, right?
[2025-11-27T08:27:11Z] <sad_plan> sewn: no, you just found something you liked better, and now vis is *shit* because of it. which is nonesense
[2025-11-27T08:28:06Z] <sad_plan> Ozymandias42: acme is from plan9, that is correct
[2025-11-27T08:29:10Z] <sewn> sad_plan: okay, how does that make nonsense
[2025-11-27T08:29:31Z] <sewn> if i was living in a shithole that i managed to find good in, and then i go to a better place, somehow i have the ability to be able to see all the good i missed out on?
[2025-11-27T08:29:41Z] <sewn> gah damn
[2025-11-27T08:29:47Z] <sad_plan> wtf, my usb hdd all a sudden gets unreadable when mounted. maybe my laptop is dying
[2025-11-27T08:30:45Z] <sad_plan> no, vis is good, because it doesnt have a bajillion features, and you sit here and complain about it lacking in features you want. having less features, is a feature, you know this
[2025-11-27T08:36:53Z] <sewn> "having less features is a feature" whaxt
[2025-11-27T08:37:09Z] <sewn> no, you know this, you prefer this feature, and i prefer that feature
[2025-11-27T08:37:30Z] <Ozymandias42> well it is. Unix Philosophy insofar as: "Do the thing you're supposed to do and do it right. Don't add stuff that might impede your primary function"
[2025-11-27T08:37:46Z] <sewn> sounds about right
[2025-11-27T08:38:22Z] <sewn> thats like taking out all the drivers of the linux kernel and all of the fancy kernel configuration features because "less is more"
[2025-11-27T08:38:34Z] <sewn> no, the unix philosphy is not all about that, its all about helping the "primary function" as said
[2025-11-27T08:38:42Z] <sewn> vis has goodies, helix has more goodies
[2025-11-27T08:39:21Z] <Ozymandias42> speaking of helix. does it have macros too like vim?
[2025-11-27T08:39:32Z] <Ozymandias42> don't think I ever needed them on helix but I remember having used it once on vim
[2025-11-27T08:41:24Z] <sewn> i dont think there are macros in helix
[2025-11-27T08:41:32Z] <sewn> vis has them and i kept activating them and it was so annoying
[2025-11-27T08:41:48Z] <sewn> ah gah damn it its a feature in helix
[2025-11-27T08:41:59Z] <sewn> record and replaying macro
[2025-11-27T08:42:05Z] <sewn> you can also define it in the config as well
[2025-11-27T09:54:18Z] <sad_plan> 'Make each program do one thing well. To do a new job, build afresh rather than complicate old programs by adding new "features".'
[2025-11-27T09:54:27Z] <sad_plan> helix is per definition less unixy than vis
[2025-11-27T09:55:31Z] <sad_plan> also, because your needs surpassed what vis' feature, doesnt mean its a worse editor. if so, it could be the other way around aswell, because helix provides more features than id like
[2025-11-27T09:56:00Z] <sad_plan> this gets neverending really, because we want different things
[2025-11-27T10:49:15Z] <Ozymandias42> To each their own. That's why we have variety
[2025-11-27T11:01:59Z] <sad_plan> yeah
[2025-11-27T12:06:57Z] <sewnsmells> good night ozy
[2025-11-27T14:09:26Z] <sewn> girlstink
[2025-11-27T14:09:46Z] <sewn> sad_plan: thats my point :3 i realized i want *more*
[2025-11-27T15:16:41Z] <kris_> sewn: i think the only thing vis is missing for me is a gitgutter
[2025-11-27T15:16:47Z] <kris_> i like seeing lines ive changed 
[2025-11-27T15:16:57Z] <kris_> i could probably write a plugin for that somehow
[2025-11-27T15:17:14Z] <sewn> I'm not sure why not use git diff
[2025-11-27T15:17:24Z] <kris_> i do
[2025-11-27T15:17:28Z] <kris_> i just like seeing changed lines
[2025-11-27T15:17:35Z] <kris_> there's not a logical reason for it i just like it
[2025-11-27T15:26:23Z] <midfavila> sewn: bringing up microkernel design as a counterargument against the unix philosophy is a really bad move considering MINIX and QNX, which are both essential technologies, are also both microkernels 
[2025-11-27T15:26:53Z] <midfavila> QNX is best unix
[2025-11-27T15:27:04Z] <midfavila> i wish blackberry had kept openqnx around
[2025-11-27T15:27:42Z] * kris_ likey the void and the netbsd
[2025-11-27T15:28:02Z] <kris_> i need to play with openbsd more, ive only used it for strictly network tasks
[2025-11-27T15:28:07Z] <kris_> like routers / vpn boxes / stuff like that
[2025-11-27T15:28:45Z] <midfavila> https://guidebookgallery.org/pics/gui/desktop/firstrun/qnx621.png
[2025-11-27T15:28:48Z] * midfavila drools...
[2025-11-27T15:28:51Z] <sewn> midfavila: what are you on about
[2025-11-27T15:29:04Z] <midfavila> sewn: exactly what i said
[2025-11-27T15:29:13Z] <sewn> sorry but I don't see how that's related
[2025-11-27T15:31:08Z] <kris_> i have thanksgiving dinner later and i'm not ecstatic
[2025-11-27T15:31:10Z] <midfavila> when you were scree'ing at sad_plan earlier you brought up removing drivers etc from the kernel as a misunderstanding of unix philosophy, or a misapplication of it, but that's not particularly accurate
[2025-11-27T15:31:26Z] <midfavila> kris_: you will eat the canned red number four jelly and enjoy it
[2025-11-27T15:32:14Z] <kris_> i need to do a frensgiving at some point
[2025-11-27T15:32:23Z] <kris_> hang out with the boys instead of everyone hanging out with their families
[2025-11-27T15:32:26Z] <midfavila> giving people friends
[2025-11-27T15:33:28Z] <kris_> one of my friends got to go see whitechapel idk if he's back in town yet
[2025-11-27T15:33:55Z] <kris_> i already know you hate whitechapel though mid
[2025-11-27T15:34:31Z] <midfavila> https://www.cbc.ca/news/world/campbell-soup-lawsuit-9.6991398
[2025-11-27T15:35:55Z] <midfavila> not as much as i hate executives
[2025-11-27T15:36:02Z] <kris_> im not a big fan of whitechapel honestlyt
[2025-11-27T15:37:17Z] <kris_> midfavila: would you like to purchase a carton of shampoo+conditioner
[2025-11-27T15:37:56Z] <midfavila> no
[2025-11-27T15:38:13Z] <midfavila> i already have a considerable quantity of horse shampoo which i intend to continue to use
[2025-11-27T15:38:16Z] <midfavila> because it's kind of awesome
[2025-11-27T15:38:25Z] <kris_> horse shampoo?
[2025-11-27T15:38:28Z] <midfavila> yes
[2025-11-27T15:38:30Z] <kris_> mid be like
[2025-11-27T15:38:30Z] <midfavila> shampoo for horses
[2025-11-27T15:38:32Z] <kris_> neigh
[2025-11-27T15:38:35Z] <midfavila> baa
[2025-11-27T15:38:55Z] <kris_> why are you using horse shampoo
[2025-11-27T15:39:08Z] <midfavila> because it works well
[2025-11-27T15:39:35Z] <kris_> this is the most you thing ive ever heard
[2025-11-27T15:39:39Z] <kris_> ive never heard of someone doing this
[2025-11-27T15:39:58Z] <midfavila> https://manentail.com/
[2025-11-27T15:39:59Z] <midfavila> ?
[2025-11-27T15:39:59Z] <kris_> i just use Blue Substance #17 that comes out of a pump bottle
[2025-11-27T15:40:07Z] <kris_> whatever my dad gets
[2025-11-27T15:40:17Z] <kris_> its some dial shampoo+bodywash
[2025-11-27T15:40:37Z] <kris_> ill be bald in a few years anyway
[2025-11-27T15:41:56Z] <midfavila> smoof
[2025-11-27T15:42:07Z] * midfavila rubs kris_' head
[2025-11-27T15:42:48Z] <kris_> so here's what's going to happen next
[2025-11-27T15:43:12Z] <kris_> i'm going to go bald, i'm going to move out to the middle of nowhere, and im going to record videos complaining about how money isn't real, porn is bad, and gnu is amazing while wandering around the forest
[2025-11-27T15:43:16Z] <kris_> and wear sunglasses on my head
[2025-11-27T15:43:24Z] <midfavila> a mini-luke
[2025-11-27T15:43:29Z] <kris_> i love luke
[2025-11-27T15:43:35Z] <midfavila> luke is a shithead lol
[2025-11-27T15:43:54Z] <midfavila> i like some of the stuff he does but he's gone off the deep end with his nonsense takes about society
[2025-11-27T15:43:57Z] <midfavila> he should stick to computers
[2025-11-27T15:44:17Z] <kris_> he's pretty vocal about a lot of the things i usually keep to myself
[2025-11-27T15:44:26Z] <kris_> i dont agree with everything he says but a good chunk of it
[2025-11-27T15:44:38Z] <midfavila> i don't agree with any of it because he ignores class entirely
[2025-11-27T15:44:39Z] <kris_> but i dont WANT to agree with everything someone says because otherwise it's just an echo chamber
[2025-11-27T15:44:57Z] <kris_> bread on penguins is based too
[2025-11-27T15:45:01Z] <kris_> she's the new luke
[2025-11-27T15:45:08Z] <midfavila> i don't watch talking heads
[2025-11-27T15:45:18Z] <kris_> bread on penguins makes mostly computer videos
[2025-11-27T15:45:27Z] <kris_> the walking in the forest yapping stuff is like 1/8th her content
[2025-11-27T15:46:20Z] <midfavila> meh.
[2025-11-27T15:46:34Z] <kris_> a lot of her more art stuff is also cool
[2025-11-27T15:46:39Z] <kris_> listen good youtubers are very rare at this point
[2025-11-27T15:46:48Z] <midfavila> good anything is rare at this point.
[2025-11-27T15:46:51Z] <kris_> her videos are good, luke smith recently released a bunch of bangers
[2025-11-27T15:46:56Z] <midfavila> i've accepted that the search is futile
[2025-11-27T15:46:58Z] <kris_> windowsgelectronics vanished, i liked her videos
[2025-11-27T15:47:10Z] <kris_> i miss druaga1
[2025-11-27T15:47:16Z] <kris_> druaga1 influenced my personality so much as a kid
[2025-11-27T15:49:47Z] <midfavila> idk ig it's hard for me to care about that stuff any more considering society is fucking collapsing 
[2025-11-27T15:50:12Z] <kris_> i feel you
[2025-11-27T15:50:23Z] <kris_> i might get there at some point but it's always been unbelievably difficult for me to care about anything at all
[2025-11-27T15:50:30Z] <kris_> mr.apathy
[2025-11-27T15:50:47Z] <midfavila> yeah it's easy to do that until it's -50 outside and you can't pay rent 
[2025-11-27T15:52:12Z] <sewnsmells> mid is using dog shampoo HAHAHHA
[2025-11-27T15:52:14Z] <sewnsmells> ur gonna take me out
[2025-11-27T15:53:21Z] <midfavila> specifically for today can you please, and i say this as politely as possible, fuck off, eva?
[2025-11-27T15:53:24Z] <midfavila> thanks
[2025-11-27T15:54:42Z] <sewnsmells> u make me laugh so hard
[2025-11-27T15:54:45Z] <sewnsmells> i love that u hate me
[2025-11-27T15:54:56Z] <sewnsmells> good bye kiss linux
[2025-11-27T16:00:48Z] <Ozymandias42> midfavila: given the harmful garbage that's in a lot of human shampoos using one made for animals is probably a good idea...
[2025-11-27T16:02:50Z] <Ozymandias42> btw. I did something cool. I changed my vMotion VLAN to MTU 9000 (jumbo frames) and also created another VLAN exclusively for my proxmox cluster to communicate with my AFF via jumbo frames too. Makes vMotion go real smooth now
[2025-11-27T16:03:21Z] <Ozymandias42> AFF = all flash filer